my guess would be its more about throttle response than HP gains. Im sure Andy will chime in at some point. But with that 440... i would think a larger TB would help
Throttle body Questions?
OK so i have a PWR440 and im using the stock T-body, is there any real worth while gains in going to a bigger TB? Any Dynos to prove it?
I know the 90mm is 90mm (i think) and the 100mm is 93mm. is there anything better from one to the other? any tuning issues?
Thanks
Newfie.
I know the 90mm is 90mm (i think) and the 100mm is 93mm. is there anything better from one to the other? any tuning issues?
Thanks
Newfie.
1 - 18 of 18 Posts
More cubic inches means you need more air to fill the additional space, the question is do you think they designed the intake system to meet more than the 6.1's needs? I doubt it
There are multiple componets to it which include the CAI, the Throttle body and the Intake manifold, any of which could be a choke point
Upgrading just the throttle body with out working on the manifold to match seem pointless to me. But thats just my opinion. How much hp will you see? Depends on how restricted you are. Remember you NA and not FI. FI is different
On my 426 I have the AFE CAI, the arrington 90mm and the intake manifold matched to the tb and also ported to match the heads. I dont know if they can port the complete runner as it pretty long
You need to look at you complete system from the air filter to the heads
There are multiple componets to it which include the CAI, the Throttle body and the Intake manifold, any of which could be a choke point
Upgrading just the throttle body with out working on the manifold to match seem pointless to me. But thats just my opinion. How much hp will you see? Depends on how restricted you are. Remember you NA and not FI. FI is different
On my 426 I have the AFE CAI, the arrington 90mm and the intake manifold matched to the tb and also ported to match the heads. I dont know if they can port the complete runner as it pretty long
You need to look at you complete system from the air filter to the heads
The answer is yes you will see a difference. I saw a difference when I did a 90mm on my 6.1L with the cam.
Like Trick said, you will need to port match the opening of the manny to accept the 90mm or else there will be a lip. Having a ported Manny will help also. I think Modern Muscle is trying to run a GB or special on their mannys right now. I'd check with them.
Having a 440, I'd say a 90mm TB and ported manny is a must have mod IMO. Good luck Newf.
Like Trick said, you will need to port match the opening of the manny to accept the 90mm or else there will be a lip. Having a ported Manny will help also. I think Modern Muscle is trying to run a GB or special on their mannys right now. I'd check with them.
Having a 440, I'd say a 90mm TB and ported manny is a must have mod IMO. Good luck Newf.
Whats you feeling about a 90mm with forced induction? I have a brand new 90mm Billet throttle body and I have been debating on getting a nice ported intake opened up to a 90 mm or just keeping my stock setup and getting a blower instead? I figure a 90mm plus a ported intake manny is only worth about .1 to.2 in the 1/4 mile anyway. So by skipping it a blower would get me much faster and then I would not be out 1500.00 for a ported intake and a 90 mm throttle body.The answer is yes you will see a difference. I saw a difference when I did a 90mm on my 6.1L with the cam.
Like Trick said, you will need to port match the opening of the manny to accept the 90mm or else there will be a lip. Having a ported Manny will help also. I think Modern Muscle is trying to run a GB or special on their mannys right now. I'd check with them.
Having a 440, I'd say a 90mm TB and ported manny is a must have mod IMO. Good luck Newf.
Sorry for the high jack guys....
I already have a ported intake flow matched to my heads, to have the inlet matched to the T-body would not be a big deal as i got a buddy that runs a machine shop.
I guess the big question is that is the 500 buxs for a 90/100 mm T-body worth it. If all i get is 5-10 hp across the board its not really worth it.
Maybe a torque converter is more worth the money......
Damn the decisions!
I guess the big question is that is the 500 buxs for a 90/100 mm T-body worth it. If all i get is 5-10 hp across the board its not really worth it.
Maybe a torque converter is more worth the money......
Damn the decisions!
Yeah decisions decisions... You do have to decide this before you powder coat you intake manny, other wise if you decide later you will crack the poweder coating on the intake manny when you try to open it to a 90mm. Also I measured my 90mm and the front is a true 90mm and the rear was only 89mm, so its not a true 90mm through out...I already have a ported intake flow matched to my heads, to have the inlet matched to the T-body would not be a big deal as i got a buddy that runs a machine shop.
I guess the big question is that is the 500 buxs for a 90/100 mm T-body worth it. If all i get is 5-10 hp across the board its not really worth it.
Maybe a torque converter is more worth the money......
Damn the decisions!
We run 90's on all of our turbo builds so far with obviously good results. I would tend to say it will make more of a difference in a NA build vs. a FI build. BBill is the only big build that I know of that's still running a stock TB...... but that's about to change.Whats you feeling about a 90mm with forced induction? I have a brand new 90mm Billet throttle body and I have been debating on getting a nice ported intake opened up to a 90 mm or just keeping my stock setup and getting a blower instead? I figure a 90mm plus a ported intake manny is only worth about .1 to.2 in the 1/4 mile anyway. So by skipping it a blower would get me much faster and then I would not be out 1500.00 for a ported intake and a 90 mm throttle body.
Sorry for the high jack guys....
Oh I see HB.... Thanks bro!We run 90's on all of our turbo builds so far with obviously good results. I would tend to say it will make more of a difference in a NA build vs. a FI build. BBill is the only big build that I know of that's still running a stock TB...... but that's about to change.
Thats hard to say as you would need someone that did it as a stand alone mod (Ideally with a 440) and hopefully did before and after results in similar conditionsI already have a ported intake flow matched to my heads, to have the inlet matched to the T-body would not be a big deal as i got a buddy that runs a machine shop.
I guess the big question is that is the 500 buxs for a 90/100 mm T-body worth it. If all i get is 5-10 hp across the board its not really worth it.
Maybe a torque converter is more worth the money......
Damn the decisions!
I went all in on mine. 426, Heads, cam, TB, injectors, Ported Intake, AFE(From a Bwoody) so no way to tell what the exact Hp gain was. But from an air flow perspective it just makes sense, if your choking your engine its not going to perform as well
Remember that an NA motor sucks air in and a FI motor forces air in, So anything you can do to increase the flow of air into the motor will help an NA motor make power
That's not necessarily true...Not all FI setups force air in. Centrifugal superchargers force air in, but Roots and Twin Screw setups suck air in (like sucking air through a straw). I'm sure some of the turbo guys can answer how the turbo introduces air, but for the most part I know each of those supercharger setups introduces air into the motor differently.Remember that an NA motor sucks air in and a FI motor forces air in, So anything you can do to increase the flow of air into the motor will help an NA motor make power
The 100 will see more power than the 90 and so on down the line. I have seen many
tests done and myself saw gains on my 440 when I went to the 90 over the 80. Gains are
gains and up to you if its worth it. Tuning should be fine, most of the early 90mm problems
have been sorted out.
tests done and myself saw gains on my 440 when I went to the 90 over the 80. Gains are
gains and up to you if its worth it. Tuning should be fine, most of the early 90mm problems
have been sorted out.
Im talking into the actual motor i.e. headsThat's not necessarily true...Not all FI setups force air in. Centrifugal superchargers force air in, but Roots and Twin Screw setups suck air in (like sucking air through a straw). I'm sure some of the turbo guys can answer how the turbo introduces air, but for the most part I know each of those supercharger setups introduces air into the motor differently.
Your just talking post or pre throttle body
But whether it s a turbo or a screw type a choke point is a choke point, granted I would think each would be affected differently and I dont know enough about either to give an educated opinion. But I would think that an NA motor would have a greater % or power increase over a FI motor having not changed the amount of boost
what do you guys think about this statement? my jeep only has the typical boltons but i was thinking 84mm would be a good idea anyway??
"HEMI TB SIZING RECOMMENDS:
My Standard Modified Hemi TB is an impressive improvement over the factory Hemi TB. It is absolutley perfect for most applications. This TB covers everything from bone stock through the typical bolton additions like aftermarket Air Intakes, Exhausts, and Programmers. My Standard Modded Hemi TB is an excellent value and will improve your performance nicely.
I do offer the bigger 84mm Hemi TB. It is meant for built motors of the next level which require more cfm than my Standard Modded Hemi TB can deliver. This means Ported Heads, Cams, Stroker Motors, and Boosted Applications.
While the "Bigger is Better Theory" is always an evil temptation proper TB sizing does not work this way. All you need to do is match your motors air requirements. Going bigger than necessary is not going to give you anything extra. Follow my recommends and get a good result."
"HEMI TB SIZING RECOMMENDS:
My Standard Modified Hemi TB is an impressive improvement over the factory Hemi TB. It is absolutley perfect for most applications. This TB covers everything from bone stock through the typical bolton additions like aftermarket Air Intakes, Exhausts, and Programmers. My Standard Modded Hemi TB is an excellent value and will improve your performance nicely.
I do offer the bigger 84mm Hemi TB. It is meant for built motors of the next level which require more cfm than my Standard Modded Hemi TB can deliver. This means Ported Heads, Cams, Stroker Motors, and Boosted Applications.
While the "Bigger is Better Theory" is always an evil temptation proper TB sizing does not work this way. All you need to do is match your motors air requirements. Going bigger than necessary is not going to give you anything extra. Follow my recommends and get a good result."
what do you guys think about this statement? my jeep only has the typical boltons but i was thinking 84mm would be a good idea anyway??
"HEMI TB SIZING RECOMMENDS:
My Standard Modified Hemi TB is an impressive improvement over the factory Hemi TB. It is absolutley perfect for most applications. This TB covers everything from bone stock through the typical bolton additions like aftermarket Air Intakes, Exhausts, and Programmers. My Standard Modded Hemi TB is an excellent value and will improve your performance nicely.
I do offer the bigger 84mm Hemi TB. It is meant for built motors of the next level which require more cfm than my Standard Modded Hemi TB can deliver. This means Ported Heads, Cams, Stroker Motors, and Boosted Applications.
While the "Bigger is Better Theory" is always an evil temptation proper TB sizing does not work this way. All you need to do is match your motors air requirements. Going bigger than necessary is not going to give you anything extra. Follow my recommends and get a good result."
I would save my money and throw a cam in the jeep instead as you will not get much out of that TB upgrade. I could see if you were running a stoker motor or Forced Induction then it would make more of a differfence so you would not see much of a difference IMO..
im not touching this thing, my warranty is till 100k as its a 2010 model, i have run TBs on other vehicles and deff noticed a difference, was just wondering about our applicationI would save my money and throw a cam in the jeep instead as you will not get much out of that TB upgrade. I could see if you were running a stoker motor or Forced Induction then it would make more of a differfence so you would not see much of a difference IMO..
Ok got ya... Yeah I am still under warranty as well and now I am on my extended max care warranty with no issues.. Cool....im not touching this thing, my warranty is till 100k as its a 2010 model, i have run TBs on other vehicles and deff noticed a difference, was just wondering about our application
yeah i have the maxcare for the bumper to bumper till 80kOk got ya... Yeah I am still under warranty as well and now I am on my extended max care warranty with no issues.. Cool....
1 - 18 of 18 Posts
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