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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
by iteself as a power adder? I was thinking it could give me a quick 20-30hp
Can it be done safely without a tune?
I have the remains of one at my shop that I'm tempted to slap on.
thanks....
 

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Yes, I have done it. Me and another member here tried it as an experiment. Some facts:

1. Yes it can be done safely without a tune.
2. Yes it does work in terms of cooling the intake charge (I have seen 40+ degree F drops in intake temps as a result of spraying 75% methanol).
3. It does reduce or eliminate engine knock, allowing you to advance timing.
4. It does work as a high octane fuel supplement when sprayed (verified with wideband O2 sensor data).

So, yes it is great. BUT...

Given all that, niether one of us saw one single iota of improvement in our 1/4 mile times. Nothing. Even though we'd have 2 - 5 degrees of knock retard on one run without the meth, then immediately run again with meth and no knock. The times are identical.

That said, we were attempting to tune for it ourselves and so maybe the gains will be there if a real tuner looks at it. I will be doing this shortly. In the end, even if it provides no benefit performance wise, I still feel like cooler cylinder temps and the elimination of knock at WOT (or close to WOT) is a nice safety feature.

The only outstanding question I would like to have answered is what grade of viton is used in the 6.1L cylinder head valve seals (and in aftermarket or ported heads as well). Some grades of viton are totally compatible with methanol, some grades will swell to double their size if exposed to methanol. Does anyone know which grade of viton is used in the 6.1 heads?
 

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To get the appropriate power out of it you need to get a tune, other wise its just there to cool your intake charge and not much will be gained by it. You need the tune so that way it can act as a boost for your octane level and you can adjust timing by being more aggressive...BUT there is draw backs, such as if your nozzle decides to quit working then you are screwed because you have advanced timing so much that if the meth is not spraying then you get knock which leads to BOOM....i never been a fan of it, as i have seen many engines fail due to people using it. There is good kits out there such as Aquamist which has a fail safe in case the nozzle doesnt spray, it will cut down your power to save the engine..but the kit is $1200..not worth IMO..its actually more benefitial for boosted vehicle as you can crank the boost higher and advanced timing
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Good stuff brotha's. Thanks for the quick responses.
 

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I have a snow perf stg iii kit with failsafe module, if it fails its set to trigger a red led on my dash, it can be set to cut out power. I have a yellow led for when the tank is at 1/3rd. I'm running a 100 plus octane tune on 87 octane fuel, works awesome, only pulls 1-2 degrees for a brief second then [email protected] I use turbo power -40c washer fluid, 45-49% methanol. What I'm really suprised with is the fact under casual driving, it doesn't even try to pull any timing at all, even up to 90mph, so a tank of meth can last quite a while if you're not loading it up. I even planned on running 91-93 tunes on 87 with a turbo or blower, but I'm thinking this will be a bit much.
 

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I agree on the tuning. But we were advancing timing and cutting fuel based on knock readings and wideband data and still no improvement in track times in 80 degree weather. I'm anxious to see if a CMR tuner can get me some gains with it. We were definitely stumped by the lack of results.
 

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Straight Up Beast SON!!!
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I agree on the tuning. But we were advancing timing and cutting fuel based on knock readings and wideband data and still no improvement in track times in 80 degree weather. I'm anxious to see if a CMR tuner can get me some gains with it. We were definitely stumped by the lack of results.
Sounds like you hit a Platoe on your setup even with meth Injection.. I thought about about this as well... How much timing were you running when you ran with Meth injection? I think you get to a point where even though you add more timing you are not making any more horsepower probably...
 

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ok, all of the non turbo or sc guys using a meth kit will not see any real advantage over not using it. :( alky meth kits were developed for the ones running turbo's or sc who wanted to get the most out of their combo. it is true that it will let you advance the timing therefore geting the best performance out of your setup without blowing your motor up. alky meth inj keeps Detination in check, which for those that run turbos or sc know that that is what kills our motors. straight M1 has an ROH of 115 which in itself acts as racing fuel. without the high price of paying $8 a gallon which will add up quick. alky meth sells for $3/4 a gallon, plus you don't use it until your into Boost. I use alkycontrol on my 87 GN & run 25lbs of Boost on 91oct. now what would happen if I try to run 25lbs on just 91oct? :rolleyes: keoni & 666creations would benefit from alkymeth. :D
 

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I've been running it for 3 years on my turbo gto and love it. Allows it to run in the summer just like it does on nice cool fall days. I have had no real issues with it.
 

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Marathon Man
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I've been using it for over a year on my Vortech system and my engine is still holding strong.

Its great cause you only use it when you are in boost.
 

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I agree on the tuning. But we were advancing timing and cutting fuel based on knock readings and wideband data and still no improvement in track times in 80 degree weather. I'm anxious to see if a CMR tuner can get me some gains with it. We were definitely stumped by the lack of results.
Try jetting down, to much spray doesn't help either.
 

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two ways to benefit from an injection system.

1. spray water and keep your setup consistent. ie keep iat in check.

2. spray 50/50 water meth, or 25/75 water meth. raise boost above pump gas threshold and advance timing. this is where you will gain power and consistency, the meth will raise octane and allow more boost and timing then pump gas will.

for option 2 you will need to tune the damn car. cant just spray more fuel and expect it to work right.

meth is cheap fix. run e85 or race gas and its a much safer setup. i am patiently waiting for someone to do an e85 tune. stuff is magic.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
ok, all of the non turbo or sc guys using a meth kit will not see any real advantage over not using it. :( alky meth kits were developed for the ones running turbo's or sc who wanted to get the most out of their combo. it is true that it will let you advance the timing therefore geting the best performance out of your setup without blowing your motor up. alky meth inj keeps Detination in check, which for those that run turbos or sc know that that is what kills our motors. straight M1 has an ROH of 115 which in itself acts as racing fuel. without the high price of paying $8 a gallon which will add up quick. alky meth sells for $3/4 a gallon, plus you don't use it until your into Boost. I use alkycontrol on my 87 GN & run 25lbs of Boost on 91oct. now what would happen if I try to run 25lbs on just 91oct? :rolleyes: keoni & 666creations would benefit from alkymeth. :D
Annoying orange says ....TRUE
 

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I was thinking about buying a kit for my diesel. Not sure about the Jeep.
 

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What about using it for just cooling reasons. I kinda wanna use with the Procharger. I am not looking for any HP Gains just from a safety stand point. I have the fear of blowing my bottom end on something I still owe 20K on.
 

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What about using it for just cooling reasons. I kinda wanna use with the Procharger. I am not looking for any HP Gains just from a safety stand point. I have the fear of blowing my bottom end on something I still owe 20K on.
It would work great for that.
 
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