Well, I have now had the Jeep in the States for 6 weeks and it sucks. I have been truly blessed for the last 4.5 years to have had two of the best commutes EVER. For the last 1 1/2 years the commute was 14 miles of rural, unrestricted-speed autobahn. The road was only five years old and there was virtually no traffic to speak of. Clear days regularly saw sprints to 150+. I truly believe that I have probably spent more time at 100+ in this Jeep than any other owner. Not bragging, just feeling blessed! Now I'm in Nor Cal with a bunch of folks that think lifted pick up trucks are the coolest thing in the world. My commute is through town and there is no where to let this thing have its fun. Not happy and ready to sell my absolute favorite toy ever. OK, enough sappy crap. 55-65 MPH sucks and my fellow Americans - by and large - are suck-ass drivers. No lane discipline, too much phone time, and turn signals must be an option from the dealer that most people deleted. Rant over. I freakin' love this Jeep, but the need for legal speed is killing me.

I feel for you man. I don't think there is a member here who did not envy your old situation.

Thanks GE - wasn't trying to rub anything in, but feeling frustrated after this AM's commute.

I also forgot to mention the scourge of American driving society! The Spouse cow driving a mini-van, stuffing her face with a Big Mac/fries/ and a large drink, smoking a cigarette, talking on the phone, adjusting the DVD for the brats in the back and checking the make-up hair in the mirror -- ALL AT THE SAME TIME!! Multi-tasking on the road is not good. But this is still the best damn country on the planet and its good to be home!! :) Just need to drive a little more defensively......

Amen to that. It's rediculous to see what people do when they are driving. Honestly, I have to politely remind my wife all the time that no matter what the kids in the back seat might be doing, saying, or asking for, she needs to get to point B before paying too much attention to them. If people just paid a bit more attention to what they're doing, we'd all have a better time driving.

Tell us how you REALLY feel.

Are you back in the States for good? If so, I guess you may need to entertain some new nicknames.. I'll start off the list for you:

BumperToBumper

SpeedingTicket


: - )

I think the biggest problem with people's lack of attention is lane discipline - if you're going to cram fast food into your mouth and talk on your cell phone, please do it in the far right lane!!! I honestly think that the majority of Americans don't even know that there is a speed/usage differential between the lanes.

Nothing can compare to the good old USA. But the other day I saw a guy actually reading a news paper while driving in the fast lane:eek: The United States - the home of the free, the brave but unfortunately sometimes the stupid.

Tell us how you REALLY feel.


The moderators would NEVER let that happen!! :eek: :)

That's an awesome garage list by the way! I'm always available to "test" drive......:cool:

Truckers STAY in the right lane in Germany!
Meanwhile......

Solid Thread Thus Far
________
Kitchen Measures (http://kitchenmeasures.com/)

Two summers ago I drove about 1,000+ miles in Italy. The Autostrada (their major highway system) was awesome. People only used the left lane to pass. There was a strongly adhered to etiquette for driving. I found it refreshing and a clear match to my natural driving instincts. I admit...I do pass in the right lane when driving here in the U.S. (a huge no-no over there). However, I feel this is a necessary evil as way too many people hang out in the left lane at a way too pedestrian speed....causing me to use alternative measures to get around their lolly-gagging a$$es. It was tough after those two weeks to put up with mini-vans in the left lane doing 55 in a 65 zone...I can only imagine what 4 1/2 years of a better driving environment did to your driving reality... my condolences.

Tom

Thanks for the condolences Tom. It was my third time living in Germany and I really can't wait to go back. We lived in Japan just before moving to Germany this time around and that was an eye-opening experience as well. They have this game of seeing how many people can run the red light.......freaky at first, but kind of fun later -- unless I was on the bike! They are pretty courteous drivers overall. I am looking to try and get back to Germany in the next year or two, so the new 08/09 500 HP GCSRT8 will be on the top of my list of vehicles to bring over this time.
Scariest place ever for me to drive/ride was my four years in South Korea......WOW!! It was like the Wild Wild West there.

Solid Thread Thus Far

Definitely agree....and Bahn....I can definitely feel your pain...what a letdown huh?

Two things I seriously think are a disgrace and a joke, are the licensing requirements in our states, and the ridiculous efforts at driver's education in our school systems.

Below is a link to Dutch Mandel's column in current Autoweek. Some food for thought.

http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070209/FREE/70205018/1049/FREE

Also....can't find the article in recent Tampa Tribune, but gist of it is this.

Someone in State house is reviving and introducing again a bill which failed last year. It is basically a law dealing with traveling in the left lane. You would be legally required to move to right lanes after a pass, or at any time another vehicle is approaching in the left lane at a speed faster than you are traveling. The fines listed were extremely stiff for "impeding the orderly and free flow of traffic." I will try to find it and post it. Hope to Hell it passes.

I have seen several signs with a phone number and address for an internet site saying "report left lane hoggers" or something to that effect.

I probably do 40 to 50K a year between my two vehicles and bike, and the driving habits of those on the Interstates and/or around town never ceases to amaze me. Defensive driving is mandated, and like an old mentor said to me.... you should always drive with one eye on the rearview mirror, one eye on the outside mirror, and one eye on the road and everyone on it.

Slightly off topic, but will share anyway. Over 49 years of driving (legally) I have received two citations for "tailgating" or following too closely. Both were when I was on someones a** flashing etc., in an attempt to get them to move right and yield. In a semi-friendly way of course. One on NJ Tpke, one in Fl. Although I did have to go to court, I prevailed both times. Dismissed. Can't quote law exactly, but both statutes basically said...."you must maintain a safe and prudent distance from the vehicle in front of you, in order to safely stop your vehicle in the event of an emergency or accident." Bottom line was there was no emergency or accident, and I walked.

Best part, was that in NJ the trooper pulled us both over...and gave the other guy a ticket for traveling to slowly in the travel lane. That driver also showed up in court, was called first and blamed it on me for crowding him. I'll never forget the Judge saying something to the effect of "why the Heck didn't you just get out of the way respecting the signs that say "Keep right except to pass"? DUH...GUILTY as charged. LOL

Sorry this is so long, but WHATEVER..............DRIVE SAFELY!!!!

ausgezeichnet bruder! bahnblast

As a UK expat I remember taking my Jags, TR6s etc. to Germany just for the trip. I miss the roads and the speed and just the good german road sense.

Of course the price of gas leaves a lot to be desired:D

Thanks for the condolences Tom. It was my third time living in Germany and I really can't wait to go back. We lived in Japan just before moving to Germany this time around and that was an eye-opening experience as well. They have this game of seeing how many people can run the red light.......freaky at first, but kind of fun later -- unless I was on the bike! They are pretty courteous drivers overall. I am looking to try and get back to Germany in the next year or two, so the new 08/09 500 HP GCSRT8 will be on the top of my list of vehicles to bring over this time.
Scariest place ever for me to drive/ride was my four years in South Korea......WOW!! It was like the Wild Wild West there.

Can't address Germany, but Japan yes...many many years ago, 68-70. Was a young guy working there for 3+ years. Was with Coca Cola Export then. 3 of the best years of my life. Had a side deal with Yamaha at the time, and rode every island (mostly exploring) on their then new 1 lung 250 DT-1. Those were the days of two cops sitting at a desk on the side of the road while one stood right in the road and "gunned" you. Pull over and pay. More than once we'd freak em out as we started to get our from under our Helmuts and leathers and they realized we were a few Gaijins.

We sponsored many Fuji speedway races.....ran it many times as a guest in my little modified Nissan Prince. Loved it.

I can also remember my secretary going for her drivers license. She had to actually log a certain amount of hours at a driving school that simulated a small town layout. Very intensive and not easy to pass. Serious attempt at educating their drivers.

You are right about the red lights too....Don't know what the set up is now, but "back in the day", they had a litle cop kiosk on the corner every few blocks with a little fishbowl, heater and phone. The game of the evening was after leaving a club, to see if we could outrun the phone call from kiosk to kiosk as they tried to get one block ahead of us and stop us. And you know how the courtesy thing goes there....if "the man" popped out of his kiosk before you got there, out of respect you stopped and awaited your fate. What fun! Man I'm getting old....Later....

Two things I seriously think are a disgrace and a joke, are the licensing requirements in our states, and the ridiculous efforts at driver's education in our school systems.




Hey, I resent that comment! As I teach Drivers Education in New Jersey, and as a former Police Officer I believe I do a DAMN good job of it. I teach the course as mandated by the state, as it is tightly controlled, however I add about 60% of my OWN personal experiences and use "real world" tactics as much as possible. The only true way to teach driving is to, well, GET OUT AND DRIVE. However, this is not possible as our school only has 2 drivers education vehicles and there is a long waiting list.

So, I presented the idea to my Principal about using golf carts that the Athletics and facilities crew use. I set up road courses and teach many of the basic skills using this method. Different? Yes, there are many dynamics that are not recreated since I'm using a smaller vehicle, but it's still driving non-the-less. Students use hand signals (since we don't have blinkers) and I even have them use the "drunk" goggles while motoring around.

We have 4 golf carts to use, and we have simulated 4 way stops, accidents, etc. I teach "The dangers of multi-tasking" while driving by having a passenger in the car constantly distract the driver. Another unit I do involves using large cards posted on tops of cones. The student has to have a conversation with another student on a cell phone, while they are driving, and they have to answer a series of questions. This widely opens their eyes to the dangers of multi-tasking while driving. This is my first year doing this program in this manner, but it has been a GREAT success so far.

So I do believe that educators can strive to do better in this department, as a whole, but we are fighting "beliefs" in this arena. It's difficult to change EVERYONES mind about how dangerous this is. However, we should strive to educate, and thats what I do every day.

Hey, I resent that comment! As I teach Drivers Education in New Jersey, and as a former Police Officer I believe I do a DAMN good job of it. I teach the course as mandated by the state, as it is tightly controlled, however I add about 60% of my OWN personal experiences and use "real world" tactics as much as possible. The only true way to teach driving is to, well, GET OUT AND DRIVE. However, this is not possible as our school only has 2 drivers education vehicles and there is a long waiting list.

So, I presented the idea to my Principal about using golf carts that the Athletics and facilities crew use. I set up road courses and teach many of the basic skills using this method. Different? Yes, there are many dynamics that are not recreated since I'm using a smaller vehicle, but it's still driving non-the-less. Students use hand signals (since we don't have blinkers) and I even have them use the "drunk" goggles while motoring around.

We have 4 golf carts to use, and we have simulated 4 way stops, accidents, etc. I teach "The dangers of multi-tasking" while driving by having a passenger in the car constantly distract the driver. Another unit I do involves using large cards posted on tops of cones. The student has to have a conversation with another student on a cell phone, while they are driving, and they have to answer a series of questions. This widely opens their eyes to the dangers of multi-tasking while driving. This is my first year doing this program in this manner, but it has been a GREAT success so far.

So I do believe that educators can strive to do better in this department, as a whole, but we are fighting "beliefs" in this arena. It's difficult to change EVERYONES mind about how dangerous this is. However, we should strive to educate, and thats what I do every day.

Appayipyip...(Damn that's long)

My apologies to you sir.....I should have worded that differently. Something like "and the ridiculously (sp) mandated standards for drivers education in our school systems." I obviously meant the programs, not those having to implement them.

Obviously, particularly in view of the efforts you are making under your own initiative, dedicated teachers can never be praised enough , or paid enough.

It is the programs themselves, the lack of hands on experience, accident avoidance training, and the real world scenarios they are NOT able to offer that concern me. I am happy to see some of the manufacturers and insurance companies getting in on the act of offering free "track" and or "parking lot" clinics to students though. Knowledge is power. Real world experience, coupled with that knowledge can often save the butt of someone. As in understanding what the contact patch (and how little) it is, or how to bring that ass end back after it has kicked out on you because of ice, emergency lane change, or whatever.

I understand some of the "beliefs" you have to deal with. I am sincere when I say you are to be applauded for your efforts. I am sure it makes it an enjoyable experience, as well as a learning one for your students.

Grew up in Monmouth Cty....(before Etown) and Atco was our home. Very good friend, (since deceased) was an unbelieveably dedicated teacher at Ocean VoTech. Your job is under appreciated. Again my apologies for the way that came off.

This is fun.

Teda, that Inferno red is clean; and sweet without a license plate on the front!

Man I'm getting old....Later....

Happens to the best of us. :D

And I agree about the "general" shape of drivers ed. I can tell you that my boys education continues well after driver's ed, including lessons from me, high speed safety schools and autocrossing.

BMW and Tirerack have a great one day program that any of you with teen drivers (maybe I'm the only one) should get your kids involved in if it comes to your town...

www.streetsurvival.org

Alex

Thanks for the reply Teda!

I totally agree that the "mandated" materials are a JOKE. In August, when I found out I'd be teaching this, I looked through the materials that the state wants us to present and teach the students. While it makes mention of defensive driving, accident avoidance, and the like...the content is laughable at best.

I understand they have to write these books for a WIDE audience, and it's parents (and soon to be parents) like yourself and Alex that also need to be applauded. You would be shocked how many parents never allow their kids behind the wheel even AFTER passing Drivers Ed. at my school. I saw a huge need for hands on experience and I'm trying to make that a reality.

I wish more parents would think as you do, and take this concept more seriously. I tell my students "When you are driving, you are in command of a 3,000lb weapon." I try to drill into their minds that the vehicle can cause immense damage, and I use a training video from EVOC while I was a police officer to illustrate this point. It's crash footage from a mere 35 mph. The energy and forces involved in this "low speed" crash are immense, and it scales up to 70mph crashes.

The students faces resemble something like this: http://forums.offtopic.com/images/smilies/eek3.gif while viewing the tapes.

I totally agree that the "mandated" materials are a JOKE. In August, when I found out I'd be teaching this, I looked through the materials that the state wants us to present and teach the students. While it makes mention of defensive driving, accident avoidance, and the like...the content is laughable at best.

Unfortunately here in my county our school system doesn't do any driver's ed training. Instead we have to use a private company, and the course lasts a fraction of the time that mine did in my high school run program back in the days of of oil lamps and slate.

Thanks for doing what you do. Unfortunately, I think we're all outnumbered by the vast masses of clueless, idiot drivers.

Alex

Well, I have now had the Jeep in the States for 6 weeks and it sucks. I have been truly blessed for the last 4.5 years to have had two of the best commutes EVER. For the last 1 1/2 years the commute was 14 miles of rural, unrestricted-speed autobahn. The road was only five years old and there was virtually no traffic to speak of. Clear days regularly saw sprints to 150+. I truly believe that I have probably spent more time at 100+ in this Jeep than any other owner. Not bragging, just feeling blessed! Now I'm in Nor Cal with a bunch of folks that think lifted pick up trucks are the coolest thing in the world. My commute is through town and there is no where to let this thing have its fun. Not happy and ready to sell my absolute favorite toy ever. OK, enough sappy crap. 55-65 MPH sucks and my fellow Americans - by and large - are suck-ass drivers. No lane discipline, too much phone time, and turn signals must be an option from the dealer that most people deleted. Rant over. I freakin' love this Jeep, but the need for legal speed is killing me.

I also feel your pain and Nor Cal is a very, very special breed of driver retardation only to be trumped by Washington state drivers who feel that driving in the fast lane at 50MPH is their sole duty in life (I hope I haven't offended anyone here).

I also feel your pain and Nor Cal is a very, very special breed of driver retardation only to be trumped by Washington state drivers who feel that driving in the fast lane at 50MPH is their sole duty in life (I hope I haven't offended anyone here).

LMAO!! Driver retardation......damn, I'm still laughing.